Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Benemal
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Nefastos wrote: Wed Mar 18, 2020 2:19 pm I was reading your post while listening to Max Don't Have Sex With Your Ex
Barf! Doubleyuck! Fleet Ditch! I suppose while you're listening to that mucusic, you're eating pizza topped with that mushy disgusting hair mush from the shower sewer plus pineapple too.
But seriously, back in the 90's that stuff made physically and mentally ill. I hated it truly. Now, despite being garbage, I hear a sincere kind of naivete, that I can't really hate. That stuff reminds me of a different time, when Finland was a weird place. Ah, the sweet sin of nostalgia...
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Benemal
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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To get back on topic, here's some danish 90's dance music I like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxZb7fxvrqs
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Nefastos
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Benemal wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:48 amBarf! Doubleyuck! Fleet Ditch! I suppose while you're listening to that mucusic, you're eating pizza topped with that mushy disgusting hair mush from the shower sewer plus pineapple too.

I see that you got my point! :lol: Personally I do not even consider it pizza anymore if it doesn't have pineapple. I'm afraid this bans my planned reincarnation back home to Italy though.

To contribute something, I'm thinking about black metal with which Boreas started this topic. It's a very alluring music genre for me, who come to music more via lyrics & thems than by the artistic essence of music itself. I think this tells much about what imagination means to me as an instrument. I would rather eat bad food while talking about delicious things than eat good food while talking about disgusting things; it is very hard for me to separate astral glamour from the actual bodily sensations. This has some pros and cons. In music which has more to do with astral glamour in a way that is pleasant to me (black metal = about Satan & occult topics) I can enjoy it even when my sensations might otherwise tell me that the art itself is not extremely good. The inner voice of those sensations is so dull when compared to the much more intense astral sensations. In a way, this is what advertising and hype also try to do, but against reason & thought, not so much against bodily sense.

It is intriguing to think about the occult approach to music as it has been in, say, Pythagorean or Orphic philosophy, or old Indian music – or, most likely, any older system which connected sacral meanings to certain melodies or rhythms. (Finnish Kantele also has this beautiful trance-inducing sound in its simplicity of basic melodies.) Could those kind of more potent sensation-based influences work their way through this kind of imagination oriented experience, and maybe cure astral overstimulation? I think they might.
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Kavi
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Nefastos wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 8:47 am
It is intriguing to think about the occult approach to music as it has been in, say, Pythagorean or Orphic philosophy, or old Indian music – or, most likely, any older system which connected sacral meanings to certain melodies or rhythms. (Finnish Kantele also has this beautiful trance-inducing sound in its simplicity of basic melodies.) Could those kind of more potent sensation-based influences work their way through this kind of imagination oriented experience, and maybe cure astral overstimulation? I think they might.
Definitely. Even though different musical traditions have taken different approaches I think the voice of the silence is in every music to be found. Whether the music is Miles Davis' music, Indian or Karelian kantele music.
I think some of the music use this Astral stimulus as an antidote in medicinal way.
For me at least in Eastern traditions certain rhythms create this feeling of ecstatic excitement and if after this there is improvisation with singer and accompanying instrument, it creates this sense of timelessness and feel that silence is everything and everywhere.
I think musician learn to somehow control his own Astral impulses through training but also manipulate sounds so well that it creates space of its own.
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Have been reading your discussion. Maybe it’s time to join now.

There’s also that kind of occult approach to music that uses “numerology”, occult geometry etc. on composing. One that comes to mind is Tool’s drummer who uses some “occult patterns” on his playing. I don’t know much of this, for I haven’t been listening Tool much or studying the topic, but maybe someone here can shed some light?
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Kenazis
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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I use mainly two ways of composing/creating music. First is what you can call musical/technical. I use my skills to create as good music for chosen project to create a chosen mood and inner landscape. Second one you can call meditative and minimalistic where I concentrate to create meditative states of mind and strong emotional state. The occult themes in first are mainly on lyrics, while on the latter the patterns and ideas are often also in music itself, and often may be "hidden" in the structure more than in lyrics. I tend always to make music that is something more, something else than it first appear to be. But also nowadays I also enjoy music just being good music and not to overthink and overanalyze. Ambient I feel is best music to just create good music for the sake of good music.
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Kenazis wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:44 am Have been reading your discussion. Maybe it’s time to join now.

There’s also that kind of occult approach to music that uses “numerology”, occult geometry etc. on composing. One that comes to mind is Tool’s drummer who uses some “occult patterns” on his playing. I don’t know much of this, for I haven’t been listening Tool much or studying the topic, but maybe someone here can shed some light?
Maybe the most famously known is fibonacci sequence in song "Lateralus" and funnily lyrics have word "overanalyzing" in it.
Although I might Incorrectly remember in this song vocal rhythm and syllables are mostly in fibonacci but I don't really know about Carrey's drums as I don't play drums and I haven't studied this phenomena as I think it's a bit trivial to try to find somekind of secret intentionally hidden meaning in rhythms.
I have really liked the band but nowadays I think occult is superficial in this rock band and although some rhythmical aspects are difficult and worth looking for (and best part of this band) I think there is nothing inheritely "deep" in this band but I might be wrong and this is just my unpopular opinion.

About overthinking I agree. Music should flow like river of life and implementing meaning of meaning in music makes it futile, arbitrary and... boring I guess?
But Lateralus is still great song. Good music is still good when it works on different levels and elements are balanced.
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Insanus
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Kenazis wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:44 am There’s also that kind of occult approach to music that uses “numerology”, occult geometry etc. on composing. One that comes to mind is Tool’s drummer who uses some “occult patterns” on his playing. I don’t know much of this, for I haven’t been listening Tool much or studying the topic, but maybe someone here can shed some light?
At some point everyone was going bananas about Dissection's Reinkaos. I've heard there is some gematric trickery in the time signatures but I don't like the music, so I haven't really bothered to look into it.

I like Death SS a lot. Somehow Thelema & rock'n'roll mix pretty well there. It feels somehow fun-loving and authentic at the same time which is rare in any music, not to mention in occult rock.
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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Insanus wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:59 pm At some point everyone was going bananas about Dissection's Reinkaos. I've heard there is some gematric trickery in the time signatures but I don't like the music, so I haven't really bothered to look into it.
I never was much into Dissection. I considered it an avarage band. Mind you I was off black metal by the time Reinkaos was released, so I never gave it a chance. But I was into Ophthalamia, which I still think was one of the best BM bands around. And both Nödtveidt brothers were involved in that. And of course the late Tony Särkkä from Abruptum. I loved their early recordings on "Evil Genius".
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Re: Occult Themes in Different Music Genres

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obnoxion wrote: Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:07 am
Insanus wrote: Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:59 pm At some point everyone was going bananas about Dissection's Reinkaos. I've heard there is some gematric trickery in the time signatures but I don't like the music, so I haven't really bothered to look into it.
I never was much into Dissection. I considered it an avarage band. Mind you I was off black metal by the time Reinkaos was released, so I never gave it a chance. But I was into Ophthalamia, which I still think was one of the best BM bands around. And both Nödtveidt brothers were involved in that. And of course the late Tony Särkkä from Abruptum. I loved their early recordings on "Evil Genius".
First time I heard Reinkaos, it was a bit disappointment, but pretty fast I began to love it. I never thought or "studied" those possible gematric things and am not sure have I even heard that idea. Must say I strongly disagree with Dissection been an average band, composition wise (and lyrically) their material are very talented and almost unique I say. I also love Ophthalamia and that band is also one of a kind. How Jon was involved in Ophthalamia? Emil was the second guitarist, that I know. I liked more the second and third Abruptum records than Evil Genious. Särkkä was also a musical genious, not very known. Everything he did was unique and many ideas he explored was something never done before, at least on such scale.

Back to Reinkaos. I've never looked that record's occult sides, except the lyrics, but I'm pretty sure there are many things hidden there, like those gematric things.
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