Fosforos and Latin in prayers

Questions directed to the Star of Azazel.
Frater Setesh
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Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:22 pm

Fosforos and Latin in prayers

Postby Frater Setesh » Mon Dec 11, 2017 2:59 pm

Just wanna say Frater Nefastos I love and admire the work you did in Fosforos very much. I just have one issue its when I'm reading the Rituals section I'll come across a prayer or hymn you wrote & it'll be in English then all of a sudden there's Latin words in the prayer. It kind of throws me off a bit. I know you had a reason for doing that I was just wondering what was the reasoning?
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Nefastos
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Re: Fosforos and Latin in prayers

Postby Nefastos » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:07 pm

Thank you Frater Setesh!

I like to use the combination of Latin and English (Finnish) in my prayer/spell working because of the following reasons:

I adore the archaic gravity, solemnity and mind-freeing associative possibilities in the "dead" languages (Latin, Sanskrit...). By gravity I mean that they lack the exoterical associations that the languages we actually speak in profane use. By solemnity I mean their linguistic feel and the beautifully floral connotations they have because of their advanced age, use and religious & magical cultural richness that has been part of their coming to being and even emphasised use (be it later, as in case of church Latin, or always, as in case of Sanskrit). While in some tantric prayers I use Sanskrit, at least in the form of mantras, in more Western opus like Fosforos, keeping mostly into Latin is better. By mind-freeing associative possibilities I mean that the coherent, holistic mind, including now only our waking mind but also the subconscious and superconscious levels that the magician works with equally, has greater freedom in working with formulae which are partly harder for the profane mind part to construct in full. Latin parts are the parts of spreading one's astral wings, so to say, of the prayers/spells. In this I am in a bit different opinion than MacGregor mathers, who thought that to understand linguistically the spell formulae was very important, and more into school of Eliphas Levi.

On the other hand, just because of the use of Latin takes part of our conscious mind a bit apart from the prayer it should not be overused. Only goetic formulae can consist only of dead language parts, while the prayers which also seek spiritual result, should include parts in "everyday" (although symbolic, poetic & equivocal) language. Ascensive prayer working, theurgy, seeks to unite the three, the waking, subconscious, and superconscious minds, and thus it must also have a part that our waking minds can grasp easily enough and operate with. Because of that, and also because not all people who can benefit from the Legifer & Clavis Magica's prayers & spells share my thoughts & associations with Latin, to any meaningful point, also the English translation is given for each of the Latin parts, so in case one wants to use only English in their reading, that is possible. In such case, I would say that the intensity is a bit lessened, but not as much as it would be should one recite the Latin parts with annoyed or suspicious attitude.
Faust: "Lo contempla. / Ei muove in tortuosa spire / e s'avvicina lento alla nostra volta. / Oh! se non erro, / orme di foco imprime al suol!"
Frater Setesh
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:22 pm

Re: Fosforos and Latin in prayers

Postby Frater Setesh » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:30 pm

Nefastos wrote:Thank you Frater Setesh!

I like to use the combination of Latin and English (Finnish) in my prayer/spell working because of the following reasons:

I adore the archaic gravity, solemnity and mind-freeing associative possibilities in the "dead" languages (Latin, Sanskrit...). By gravity I mean that they lack the exoterical associations that the languages we actually speak in profane use. By solemnity I mean their linguistic feel and the beautifully floral connotations they have because of their advanced age, use and religious & magical cultural richness that has been part of their coming to being and even emphasised use (be it later, as in case of church Latin, or always, as in case of Sanskrit). While in some tantric prayers I use Sanskrit, at least in the form of mantras, in more Western opus like Fosforos, keeping mostly into Latin is better. By mind-freeing associative possibilities I mean that the coherent, holistic mind, including now only our waking mind but also the subconscious and superconscious levels that the magician works with equally, has greater freedom in working with formulae which are partly harder for the profane mind part to construct in full. Latin parts are the parts of spreading one's astral wings, so to say, of the prayers/spells. In this I am in a bit different opinion than MacGregor mathers, who thought that to understand linguistically the spell formulae was very important, and more into school of Eliphas Levi.

On the other hand, just because of the use of Latin takes part of our conscious mind a bit apart from the prayer it should not be overused. Only goetic formulae can consist only of dead language parts, while the prayers which also seek spiritual result, should include parts in "everyday" (although symbolic, poetic & equivocal) language. Ascensive prayer working, theurgy, seeks to unite the three, the waking, subconscious, and superconscious minds, and thus it must also have a part that our waking minds can grasp easily enough and operate with. Because of that, and also because not all people who can benefit from the Legifer & Clavis Magica's prayers & spells share my thoughts & associations with Latin, to any meaningful point, also the English translation is given for each of the Latin parts, so in case one wants to use only English in their reading, that is possible. In such case, I would say that the intensity is a bit lessened, but not as much as it would be should one recite the Latin parts with annoyed or suspicious attitude.
Oh ok I understand now thanks for clearing that up for me I appreciate it.

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