"Preservation of Seed"

[Vanadís]

Interesting topic, I’ve been talking a lot about it during the recent years with my friends – some of them have been in celibacy for many years trying to cultivate the sexual energy to the spiritual one. One of them was very nonsexual person and felt good when totally limiting sexuality. Two of them seem to have very wild life after celibacy years and it seems to me that they are now trying to break out obsessively something that is not anymore flowing naturally, but is blocked by force.

For me initiation is holistic. I don’t see my body lower than mind or spirit. Every part of me is holy. But, I must understand this holiness to let the body be as vessel serving the whole. For me conserving the seed is in a way just another patriarchal way to see human via masculine stereotype “penetrate or be in celibacy – women are sinful/bad/stealing your stuff”. For me sexuality is something that arises from the matriarchal way to see the sexuality as a joyful part of life & death, holy union between the couple. When the couple is equally enjoying and giving – both are building and mirroring each other’s fire.

I’ve been exploring Tantric part of sexuality in actuality just a little while and experienced the huge difference between so called normal sex compared to Tantric sexuality, where Love and Union is present and finally the Kundalini rises through the body. I’m not sure if this can happen in a normal relationship, but with another Magician and naturally skilled Tantric person the energies are combined in very different, powerful way. The moment when the Serpent Fire first time rose through my body was Spiritual; I felt the whole cosmos was opening above my head and my body was 100 times more in flames than with the normal orgasm. All I could do was just to cry out the spiritual and holistic beauty of the experience. Now I try to be conscious when the Kundalini rises and rotate it back to my beloved’s body and Heart Chakra. All of this have happened very naturally, without any plans to have any sort of Tantric Kundalini experiences. What I'm saying here is, something very "carnal" can be very spiritual too, even opening the new ways and horizons.

I also see semen & women fluids as naturally sacred vital force, which are to be combined like lovers coil themselves in to the caressing hug. Together they are more, in the woman’s “Graal” they can even form a new life, a vessel to new soul to born. That is the greatest sacrament in life, creating new life from your bodies and from your love. Sex and birth are close to death too, at least in feminine energies. I think we can see that in the goddesses like Freya, Astarte, Ishtar and Anat. Fertility and love is combined with the aspect of the war goddess. If I put this to very carnal level; if I’m not getting orgasms regularly (with myself or my loved one) I’ll go nuts and boil in anger and frustration. If my sexuality is treated well with regular happy comings, my whole essence is glowing in creative fire. I make art, I write books, I live. Sexuality and Love are my muses, like Death and suffering are too.

As I said earlier, sexuality is very natural for me and my beloved fra RZ. We don’t do sex magic rituals as practitioners in Western Occultism or Thelema usually do. But for example is one special occasion I wanted to bless his bodies (all of them) before making love. I knelt before him and kissed his body from feet to head saying this my-version-of traditional Five fold kiss:

Blessed be thy feet
that have brought you in this way
Blessed be thy knees
that shall kneel on the sacred altar
Blessed be thy phallus and semen
who are the givers of life
Blessed be thy heart
Let it beat strongly with love and passion
Blessed be thy lips
Let them pour the right words and always speak the truth
Blessed be thy eyes
Let them see the beauty in life and beyond the veils of Maya
Blessed be you, son of the Gods (this final kiss to the forehead)

I don’t normally share this openly about my sexuality, because I think the sacredness of sexuality grows while kept in secret between the lovers. But I see so much statements about non-sexual wisdom or asceticism among the Theosophy folks or another Easter based occultism, that I want to share my different experiences arising more from Western or Middle Eastern Goddess religions and Thelema. I understand very well, that different persons may have good life & spiritual growth in celibacy or with regulated sexuality, but I also think these same regulations are causing much perversions and damage among the spiritual people.

At the end I’d like to add my old blog post about Tantric love:

When you are feeling Love, come out of your head and settle down into your Heart. When you make love, let go of your thoughts and Be. Be present, feel and breathe the love. Love does not need words, verbalizing or concepts. Love is experienced purely from the core of your soul.

I once read a Tantric text, where Shiva told how human should transform himself to Love. When you caress someone, become that caress, become that kiss, become that skin which kindles under the fingers. When you and your lover become One, there is no heartbeat anymore, it´s the beat of Love. Circulating blood is turning to the circulating Love. This is the alchemy of making carnal bodies to something deeper, union of Shiva & Shakti. In the moment of Union there is a free space, where two Hearts are sharing the same consciousness.

Feel making love instead of thinking it... lose control. Go into chaos, go into uncontrol and lose your fear. Conscious Tantric love and the deep connection between lovers might go so borderline of feelings that one's mind want to take Control. That is a last restrictive feeling before going to the Abyss. Without practice people think they will get lost to the Abyss. Don't listen to the mind, get lost. Seek the timelessness. You will be one with your lover, but still your own consciousness is getting sharper. But you will not be there - it's the awareness who is there.

With Love & Will,
Soror Vanadís

[Insanus]

Beautiful post! It also reminded me of a part in "Writings on magic" (not yet translated) article, I guess it was "Fohat" where energy is sublimated to either atma, or prana. I think that the preservation, celibacy, or main focus on death is atmic emphasis reaching for Absolute, and the sexual, tantric approach or focus in Love unleashes that energy from the "state of pure potential" to something actual, namely prana to vivificate the waking consciousness, like Shiva-Shakti. Does this make sense?

[RaktaZoci]

Beautiful post! It also reminded me of a part in "Writings on magic" (not yet translated) article, I guess it was "Fohat" where energy is sublimated to either atma, or prana.

These synchronicities have been more than numerous lately! I am just translating precisely that text.

[Heith]

It is more and more clear that these are questions of temperament. While I, for example understand well what Sor Vanadis means, from my personal point of view I disagree with many a point- that is to say, what I would find to be of interest and use to me. For example I do not at all agree that with "the greatest sacrament in life, creating new life from your bodies and from your love.". But I know and understand that many do, and that is fine and correct for people who have different aims and temperaments than I do. I can sign said statement when the aim is not to create a human child but, for example, a work of art or an idea. I do not of course belittle anyone's choice to become a parent, merely illuminate my own point of view.

When it comes to erotic, let's say tantric, love, I have always been more fascinated by ideas than the act. I would not go and claim that I would be asexual, but can be perfectly content without a partner and without any sex. Likewise I am rather neutral to things that majority finds off-putting (of course here I do not refer to anything that is harmful to someone, as these are always acts that ought not to be tolerated). Like I mentioned on my previous post, I see every act as a sexual one, but not necessarily a erotic one. To observe and partake into these actions one does not require a partner in the physical sense, not even in the erotic actions.

It crosses my mind that perhaps this is also a question of our zodiac and which planets rule at the time of our birth. I, ruled by Saturnian sign, am much prone to mortification, melancholy and other fine traits as described by the renaissance astronomists. And yet I know there's need for also those who are more into vivification. That's the beauty and interest of sexuality, that there's such a great variety.

[obnoxion]

Women are always to be avoided. One should stay far off from them. A shrew person views them as he views the corpses. He should have the same attitude in the sexual intercourse with his own wife, as when discharging the faeces and urine on the ground. There should be no attitude other than this. Woman is like a burning coal; man is like a vessel of ghee. He should always avoid contact with women therefore.

I think this is one of the most critical realizations for our Age, that we live the Age of Tantric Instruction. Indeed, Ghee is supposed to be sacrificed. This is echoed in the bible, where the Fat is reserved for the Lord.

In this age, when we come across instructions like the one quoted above, we need to contemplate the holiness of corpses, feces, urine and the very ground which receives these sacred discharges. I do not mean that our Age calls for scatological fetishism. I mean it calls for serious and balanced pursuit for advaya- jnana, or the nondual-gnosis.

On a personal note, I am prone to fantasizing, and a strict Zoharist might say that I support a legion a demons by my license. But I think I’d do worse by abstinence. In the end I cannot accept a view where there would be any force or being fundamentally other from myself, and thus by strictly starving my demons is like amputating my inner organs whose functions are still unknown to me. I rather think that the critical part is regulating the energies of our communions. One particularly occult method I’ve used is to contemplate the relations of King Solomon to his wives and concubines as an inner process of the Soul in relationship to its aspects and attributes. This is also a good example of the kind of Tantric interpretation of our old religious traditions I meant earlier.

Aside from inner practices, a concrete practice I strive to maintain is a life-long monogamy. There are many reasons for it. For example, I do think that by engaging in many short term relationships I would be fooled into a dreadful monotony, as I would only experience the beginnings of relationship which I think have little variation underneath the surface of richness, and I would miss out on the rare subtleties of maturation, only reserved for the few and the blessed. I’ve come to realize that unlike the orgastic enjoyments which are easily fantasized in vivid detail, these mature subtleties are almost unimaginable unless experienced firsthand.

As I said earlier, sexuality is very natural for me and my beloved fra RZ. We don’t do sex magic rituals as practitioners in Western Occultism or Thelema usually do. But for example is one special occasion I wanted to bless his bodies (all of them) before making love. I knelt before him and kissed his body from feet to head saying this my-version-of traditional Five fold kiss:Blessed be thy feetthat have brought you in this wayBlessed be thy kneesthat shall kneel on the sacred altarBlessed be thy phallus and semenwho are the givers of lifeBlessed be thy heartLet it beat strongly with love and passionBlessed be thy lipsLet them pour the right words and always speak the truthBlessed be thy eyesLet them see the beauty in life and beyond the veils of MayaBlessed be you, son of the Gods (this final kiss to the forehead)

Sounds like a beautiful practice!

I've been thinking about a practice based on the lists of spiritual beings in charge of our many body parts, listed in some of the rediscovered Gnostic Texts. I think it might help one to connect to one's body by acceptance through adoration. It could work well in a sexual setting such as you described above.

[Cancer]

Some years ago I read an interview of a priest (Evangelical Lutheran, I believe) in the Finnish church's magazine Kirkko&Kaupunki. When asked about the connection between eroticism and spirituality, this guy answered something like "secular people believe that prayer is disguised sex, but I believe that actually sex is disguised prayer". That's something I've always tried to remember and act according to, although it's been difficult at times.

I'm more of the type that isn't suited for abstinence. Having sex regularly with someone close to me actually helps my creativity and gives me a feeling of "flow". Eroticism in all its aspects is very essential to the relationship I'm in, and has brought me closer to my beloved than anything else could have. It's beautiful, sacred, and just plainly fun. Pure love made work in a dirty way...

I've also had my problems with sexuality, though. There's a topic on this on the Finnish side, and I still can't read my own two-year-old posts there without being so ashamed of myself that I want to vanish. Around that time it became clear for me that in the wrong circumstances I could become so addicted to and obsessed about sex that it could be taken as a sickness, and I reacted to this insight in a way that was... erm... not optimal. I basically took total control of sexuality as my ideal, although I tried to talk about it in much softer words. There was no direct harm done, but as I exercised my newly found control, trying to make everything about sex as pretty and nice and clean as possible, I started to feel really lost and fuzzy. It felt as if I'd lost contact with something.

This should illuminate the way in which sex and prayer are connected. Reaching out of the superficial, shell-like everyday personality is the core element in both, and if that personality tries to control how this reaching-out happens, it can't happen at all. To continue using myself as an example: I'd tried to "sublimate" certain aspects of my sexuality because I coudn't adopt them as parts of my "public" identity, per-sona as in mask - I couldn't be open about them, and the difference between my private and public selves brought about too much tension for me to handle. Note the word: erotic feelings are often described as tension, that is, a force - that could be used for good purposes as well. But to do that one has to be strong enough to keep a secret, to maintain the tension.

The same goes for being in contact with divinities through prayer. One can't freely talk about ones practices in this area, because divinities, arcetypes, masters or whatever are, in a way, completely beyond the human social world. The two can't be brought together, so one or the other has to go (usually just for the duration of the practice, of course). It could be said that one has to be completely alone with the divinity/archetype/master in question, just as one has to be alone with ones partner to share sexual intimacy. Giving up too much information to the outside "breaks the spell" in both cases.

This could be my interpretation of the "preservatin of seed" practice. Not to abstain from, but to maintain the (erotic) tension between oneself and whatever one wants to approach. To make life more alive, more electric by keeping silent in the right places.

[Insanus]

To make life more alive, more electric by keeping silent in the right places.

Yeah.
I feel like the subtle difference between symbolic connotations of words magnetic and electric might be a key to understanding the many different views & personal preferences expressed in this thread in a uniting way.

[Nefastos]

In the end I cannot accept a view where there would be any force or being fundamentally other from myself, and thus by strictly starving my demons is like amputating my inner organs whose functions are still unknown to me.

I feel exactly the same, and follow a somewhat similar code, namely, using the astral working to veil the divine attributes as something that can be worked with & enthralled by.

Aside from inner practices, a concrete practice I strive to maintain is a life-long monogamy. There are many reasons for it.

Yes, I too feel that would be the ideal way for the most today. My own marriage ended a few years ago (we were together for ten years), but that didn't change my positive view on monogamy. If something, it made me respect the ceremonial side of it even more: not only having one sexual & romantical partner at the time, but also underlined the mystery-nature of the said institute as well as the ethical & alchemical side, which I considfer interwoven.

But yes, the modern time is the one with the million faces. Where Linga Purâna gave first the sexual practices for the hermit yogis and next the before mentioned "compromise morals" (with a possibility for the tantric reading included) for the husbands, I think the modern way might be to give the first set of occult practices for those practising monogamy, & the second for those who do not see their sexuality that way. Luminous beings we are, not this crude matter.

That also makes me to think Perennialists' quite harsh view on yugas: How the ages get corrupted even more, until everything finally collapses. Perhaps such a view has been limited by too exoteric thinking, and the idea of the ages (satya, treta, dvapara, kali; or the golden to the black age) should be interpreted as dispersion of dogma. As said in Fosforos and elsewhere, the truth cannot be lost. Also, those unable to understand truth cannot understand it whatever the cultural age. Thus, while everything becomes seemingly more shattered, the truth actually multiplies, and that which seems like corruption is the most fertile process of all - yea, even the very meaning of both micro- and macrocosmic life. Not advancement per se or stillness, for in those cases nothing would have ever emerged from the perfect state of Absolute Unity, but that what we call time is actually the Absolute enfolding its absolutely absolute possibilities of differentiated unity. Thus everything "not true" is something "yet to be understood", like there are no facets in the Rubik's cube that would be unneeded or, as you said, no demons that are not our very own functioning organs. The problem with this kind of thinking have mostly been a too personalized view on God, having to do with morals of another and not the ethics of our own - which, paradoxically, thus become just the ethos of the Logos, even that of the Absolute (!) in this reading.

[Sothoth]

This is a good topic! I have found this topic hard and painful and have thought this question for years but I haven't found a simple solution yet (of course). Sexuality is so difficult thing, making us feel the greatest joy and the greatest pain. I too think that those instructions of Linga Purana are outdated in most cases. Perhaps this is connected to the rise of collective progression of intelligence, that is (theosophical) manas as the sexual creative impulse is connected to manas or Venus-Lucifer, if you will.

Kali Yuga is the age of dissolution governed by Kali, so traditional Right Hand Path occultists would often make the mistake of thinking Kali yuga as corrupt. But this is obviously not the case as everything in this universe is one and there aren't any good/bad dualism in it. In some ways the Kali Yuga would be the highest of all Yugas, because Kali is the goddess of the perfect black, that is the uncreation and dissolution of everything. The greatest possibilities are hidden behind the veiled goddess.

Shiva is on the other hand connected to this "seed", methinks. The unmovable dot (the rune Ingwaz comes in mind). But Shiva alone would be nothing without the great goddess. Of course the ideal would be to preserve this seed, but nature makes no jumps. In our modern age it would be often important first to learn the lesson of those tamasic demons, because of course they aren't without function in nature, although they often seem decadent to us. The Moon goddess is in itself pure energy, but it is corrupted by our traumatic psychology. The lesson a magician should take is try to understand the hidden meaning in those cardinal "sins" such as lust. Of course remembering the true will, love and understanding (atma-buddhi-manas) in this tantric process.

[Heith]

Shiva is on the other hand connected to this "seed", methinks. The unmovable dot (the rune Ingwaz comes in mind). But Shiva alone would be nothing without the great goddess. Of course the ideal would be to preserve this seed, but nature makes no jumps.

Or Freyr and Freyja, whom I think a kind of Yin and Yang- a balance of nature where he is in the centre of her as a seed. Also, Crowley's Book of the Law

In the sphere I am everywhere the centre, as she, the circumference, is nowhere found

which is I understand to be of a similar expression.