The Profits of Sectarianism

Convictions, morals, other societies and religions.
obnoxion
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The Profits of Sectarianism

Postby obnoxion » Mon Dec 04, 2017 7:38 am

Where there is faith, there is also sectarianism. Or is there?

If sectarianism is passion about the particularities of one's spiritual nomination, I do not think it is a bad thing at all. And relegious forms can be beautiful just like like natural forms - just as pearls snd flowers or clouds and tigers can be beautiful, so can religuous forms. You do not have to pick a flower, dive a pearl, touch the sky or ride the tiger to appreciate these forms in a profound way. And I personally think that we sometimes should dig deep to find this kind of appreciation, because the prevalent model of baffled disdain under a thin vail of mandatory tolerance is not a sustainable state.

It is generally not hard take joy in the forms of other people's religious form. We can even be uplifted by them, I think, if we are able to allow ourselves to. That does not have to mean that we lose ourselves or the forms we are attached to.

The ills of sectarianism, however, are all too familiar to us. I felt it, for example, after having to go to the city center a day after a terrorist attack had happened there. And even last week when I went to the city, I thought I heard the screams of hurt children and I was alarmed, before I realized that the noise came from the yard of a big school where kids were just having some loud fun.

But though a sectarian bias might not turn to physical violence, it can still shape our souls into monstrous shapes. I remember being thought a queer metaphysical doctrine in school that the christians who go to heaven are changed by God in a way, that they are unable to feel sorry for their loved ones that are sent to Hell for eternity, and whose sufferings the blessed are watching from heaven. I remember that every fiber of my being revolted against this abominable doctrine, that adults saw fit to teach children . So sectarianism can also pervert ones intention into a sort of constant state of cursing.

I know that these downsides are easy to come by, and you can share some if you wish. But most of all I would like to hear about the profits of sectarianism, so please include some upsides in your post also.
One day of Brahma has 14 Indras; his life has 54 000 Indras. One day of Vishnu is the lifetime of Brahma. The lifetime of Vishnu is one day of Shiva.
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Nefastos
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Re: The Profits of Sectarianism

Postby Nefastos » Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:08 am

I think that sectarianism is necessarily excess (of emphasis) of something, and excess is not necessarily a bad thing. Most often it probably holds such a danger, but aren't many of the most beautiful things in this world such that they can safely exist only in some rare places & times? Isn't true beauty also rarity and thus choose forms that are delicate and bizarre?

I think that even Satanism could be said to be a form of sectarianism. Maybe it's not the best approach, but still a possible one. It uses and emphasizes a name taken from another pantheon, Judeo-Christian doctrine, after all. And this form of religiosity, Satanism, is usually so rare, that it might often leave people blinking in astonishment: "Why are you worshipping such an entity? Isn't that necessarily a form of insanity or possession?" And yet, as Satanists, we see the whole thing very differently. What is excessive often comes near to that which is very pure even if fragile from the viewpoint of the mind, and grotesque is often fascinating, sometimes sacred. So, sectarianism might, theoretically, be closer to esoteric doctrines than more common forms of worship/theology.
Faust: "Lo contempla. / Ei muove in tortuosa spire / e s'avvicina lento alla nostra volta. / Oh! se non erro, / orme di foco imprime al suol!"
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Insanus
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Re: The Profits of Sectarianism

Postby Insanus » Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:22 am

When we use psychologically loaded language (and we might have to do so, if we are to express psychologically loaded, very meaningful things) we have to assume that the listener understands what and how and why we are using the words we use. Some do, some don't and the people who understand the language similarly, form a sect. I don't mean just semantics, but rather that the set of experiences associated with certain concept or a symbol is similar enough that we can sincerely say "yes you understand me". One can think of family and intimate relationships as "sects" and the life lessons from those as sectarian biases, for example. In global context maybe you could argue that even nations are sects.

If sectarianism is a passion there is nothing going wrong. Maybe problems begin when passion becomes internalized identity that needs to be jealously protected?
Myrkky sattuu siihen jolla on haava.
obnoxion
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Re: The Profits of Sectarianism

Postby obnoxion » Tue Dec 05, 2017 11:58 am

Insanus wrote: If sectarianism is a passion there is nothing going wrong. Maybe problems begin when passion becomes internalized identity that needs to be jealously protected?
Or maybe the problem is when the sectarian polemics become externalized (where there is, of course, a parallel process of wounding internalization). Is see the cultivation of dualism fundemantally serving at least two basic goals: energization and personification.

So, for example, in Christianity dualisim helps to personify Jesus making him more available as an object of devotional love, and it energizes, giving zeal, stamina and inspiration.

But when we use this dualism to externalize and generalize the idea of the Jews as "christkillers", and unleash centuries of cruelty and havoc upon the world, we have incarnated the dark mask of dualism, because that is the automatic consequence of fundamental externization of dualism

I think I have seen esoterists energize themselves with dualism to the point of self-destruction. So one coud really compare the process to a rose stem, that has one flower, but a hundred spikes.

Echoing the profound perspective of frater Nefastos above, the essence of my Satanism is the reinerpretation of the Witches Sabbath and the Black Mass, which I see as something that has been succesfully done in Buddhist and Hindu tantras (perhaps also in Jainism and some schools of far Eastern Islam, and in some lost traditions like Saurism). So in this way, Satanism is - for me, at least - re-establishing the energies of Christian dualism under the power of Love. And as can be well understood, this can be a fragile process.
One day of Brahma has 14 Indras; his life has 54 000 Indras. One day of Vishnu is the lifetime of Brahma. The lifetime of Vishnu is one day of Shiva.
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Insanus
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Re: The Profits of Sectarianism

Postby Insanus » Tue Dec 05, 2017 1:00 pm

Well that was very well put. I completely agree.
Myrkky sattuu siihen jolla on haava.

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