"Dark" in Satanism

Convictions, morals, other societies and religions.
Hairetikos
Frater
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:56 pm

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Hairetikos »

Definitely dark. As I aim to live and to survive in this ever-changing world of ours, I see the whole process as a great act of death worshipping. Death meaning transitions and some current blasting through ages forever. It includes going to unknown and fairly often unpleasant places, to somewhere literally dark, where one can only have trust (hopefully) to self, or Self if you may.

The horrors in the world give me inner nausea every day but I've chosen to try and view them without repulsion in order to accept them as a part of this game we've gotten ourselves into and to understand the madness at some level, even some fragments of it. I must emphasize that by "accepting" I don't mean to give green light to violence, destroying environment and greed etc.

I find the most blissful peace in solitude, so I can relate to fra Kenazis' thoughts very much. Also I dont value for example blackmetal imagery or concepts of "occult" made by popular culture at all when it comes down to such precious things like spiritual work. They are there, and worked out as a great firestarter like 20 years ago but that's about it 2020 A.D. Entertainment is entertainment.
User avatar
Nefastos
Frater
Posts: 3873
Joined: Mon May 24, 2010 10:05 am
Location: Helsinki

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Nefastos »

Hairetikos wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:19 pm
As I aim to live and to survive in this ever-changing world of ours, I see the whole process as a great act of death worshipping. Death meaning transitions and some current blasting through ages forever.

Speaking of transitions & ages, I think that one's approach to "dark", as well as "light" (English word is a good one here, since it has both meanings of illuminated & having only a little of weight) has much to do with her aspect choice, i.e. that part of temperament that can change during the time of a single life. The Great Work's current phase for an individual.

I have gone through the four aspects of The Book of Paths. For me personally the years have went approximately like this:
From age 14 to 17: Grey
From age 17 to 23: Black
From age 23 to 27: Red
From age 27 onwards: White

During these phases, my attitude towards the "dark" has changed quite a lot:

In Grey: Divided between intriguing & fascinating on the one hand, and frightening on the other. Fascination of the dark grows from inward shapes to outward, and nightmares first start to leak outwards as more astral forms of discomfort.

In Black: Total absorption & fascination of the dark and most utter death imaginable, plus middle aspects of living death (among other forms of darkness manifesting in waking life). Astral discomfort slowly purifying in more bright, but still problematic, astral experiences.

In Red: Fascination of death & collapsed downward sympathies wrestled – with the slowly growing aid of practical light side emphasis – into healthier uses, in order not to leak negative impressions into the outside world or corruption of bodily life. (Earlier I had some misguided thoughts of a possibility of attaining death or spiritual martyrdom from choosing the dark: later it became clear that such will never result in actual annihilation, but only in spirally added torment & inner perversion; in other words, literally never ending hell.)

In White: The pragmatic use of "light" culminating in a joking, seemingly "light", attitude towards like as a process. Choosing light forms as a form of juggling: keeping energies in motion, giving dynamic vital force to things that would otherwise start to become spiderwebby & down-weighing. Added playful & childish attitude towards life because of pragmatic reasons. Thinking that the whole word is so fundamentally mad & primitive that it would be madness to take it seriously inside & outside, and since not taking things seriously inside would lead to hurting other beings, the "light" must be chosen for the outside use.

One interesting thing in going through one such cycle (there is no end to how these aspects turn into each other in an ascending spiral of development) is that aesthetics have in every turn changed more into pragmatic use. The more one wrestle's with the inner angels, the less important it becomes how something is felt personally: is it temperamentally nice for me or not. If it is needed, it must be used; if the use leads the whole to a bad direction, it must not be used, even though I might personally enjoy such an emphasis. From this change of view have for me emerged a view that demands the use of quotation marks in "dark" and "light". Is my sincere but (in a way) hopeless wish that the whole cosmos would collapse into the absolute night of one being a "dark" or "light" hope? For most people, such a view is a horrible, most pathological apex of death worship. For me, it has very little "dark" in it. And perhaps at some point of my life, that wish could transform in a kind of more meditative & mystic stage, which might see that sought Pralaya as an inner union with God, transcending its deeply wounded aspects of yearning after annihilation.
Faust: "Lo contempla. / Ei muove in tortuosa spire / e s'avvicina lento alla nostra volta. / Oh! se non erro, / orme di foco imprime al suol!"
obnoxion
Sodalis
Posts: 2168
Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 7:59 pm

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by obnoxion »

Mine is a sort of ghostly Satanismi. It is dark, but quite weightless. I am traditional in the sense that I stress the symbolism the black mass and the witche's sabbath, but I treat them as nondual interpretative challenges. I also have a deep interest in horror fiction.
One day of Brahma has 14 Indras; his life has 54 000 Indras. One day of Vishnu is the lifetime of Brahma. The lifetime of Vishnu is one day of Shiva.
User avatar
Ave
Posts: 226
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:15 pm

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Ave »

Nefastos wrote:
Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:44 pm

In White: The pragmatic use of "light" culminating in a joking, seemingly "light", attitude towards like as a process. Choosing light forms as a form of juggling: keeping energies in motion, giving dynamic vital force to things that would otherwise start to become spiderwebby & down-weighing. Added playful & childish attitude towards life because of pragmatic reasons. Thinking that the whole word is so fundamentally mad & primitive that it would be madness to take it seriously inside & outside, and since not taking things seriously inside would lead to hurting other beings, the "light" must be chosen for the outside use.
This reminded me of the 16:th chapter of Tao te Ching (translation: Stephen Mitchell):
(...)
When you realize where you come from,
you naturally become tolerant,
disinterested, amused,
kindhearted as a grandmother
(...)

Giving it a thought... I realize that I've only embodyed suchlike genuine empathic disinterest only on rare occasions, in passing glimpses. So far, my light, white disinterest has been (somewhat reactional?) trickster-like, joker activity: like the laugh of a fool who realizes being trapped on a ghost train.
If you want to reborn, let yourself die.
User avatar
Smaragd
Frater
Posts: 789
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 5:27 am

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Smaragd »

While I don’t see ”morpid fascination of things that are aesthetically dark & ambiguous” as good definition of my Satanism, and I’ve felt like an outside in circles where such aesthetics have been taken as some sort of life style choice, I do think these are all of the same impulse of the entity of Satan. Like obnoxion said, these can be seen as nondual interpretative challenges. Maybe in some cases the fascination have slipped to perverse angles, and the appreciation of the aesthetics have burned on the surface level in a way that it’s hard to see through what’s on the other side. Sometimes the darkness of the unconscious seem to have been looked in to a bit, but usually there’s a mess of dualism that creates confusion and a prison where the symbolism can not be reached in an understanding way. While we have rich traditions of mythical texts and tales, I feel like our fragmented culture is painfully lacking skills for interpreting symbolism in a wholesome way. I’m not sure if these skills could be teached for highschool aged kids, for I see it’s a bit problematic and may require a calling to be taken upon, but it could be an important step culturally.

The darkness in Satanism means to me something like ”obscurity” of the unconscious, non-linear approaches, the nature of creative – descending – powers. When I’m somewhat detached from these things I feel like I’m failing in Satanism, or just going through part of the cycle that is momentarily far from Satanism. Such phases often feel a bit alarming and unbalanced, and it’s hard to create anything of value. Creatively couple of such occasions have been like a frozen hell. In a bit contradicting way such a place ”far from the darkness, full of linear thinking” could be interpreted as Saturnian low point of emanation where the powers solidify. But it’s actually far from the light and in such dualist position unable make fruitful relations to the non–linear functions of the darkness. Thus under such harsh dualism, darkness sort of secretly gains the ”linear functions” of light (I know this sort of division of functions is not without problems), to compensate and maintain the existenece of the wounded position. Similarly ”Dark Satanism” could be seen a wounded position of image and identity, to which Nefastos already pointed to in the thread.

Still, I must say that through dark aesthetics it is often that I feel instantly connected to the most true identity of mine, that is the inner Master. But again, such connections are also half astral and thus a bit wavery and half in the dark.
User avatar
Insanus
Frater
Posts: 1015
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:06 am
Location: Helsinki

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Insanus »

In my desperation to gain some understanding of Lacan's obscure concepts, I stumbled upon this video about his concept of the Real:

https://youtu.be/1UPhrQjHi_s

The Real means something like reality unmediated by language and imagination, something like a world stripped of all meaning. It's beyond all signification and comes to our experience only through traumatic experience.
I've thought of the Joker in the 2008 batman movie "Dark Knight" as Satan's avatar in that universe, as some kind of inverse psychoanalyst/social critic, a person who tries to break the symbolic order and force this Real into human experience (if "normal" therapy tries to knit the subject's world back together). This kind of void through a broken reality is something I consider essential "dark" experience to my satanism.
With a taste of a poison paradigm
User avatar
Smaragd
Frater
Posts: 789
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 5:27 am

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Smaragd »

Insanus wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:02 pm
In my desperation to gain some understanding of Lacan's obscure concepts, I stumbled upon this video about his concept of the Real:

https://youtu.be/1UPhrQjHi_s

The Real means something like reality unmediated by language and imagination, something like a world stripped of all meaning. It's beyond all signification and comes to our experience only through traumatic experience.
I've thought of the Joker in the 2008 batman movie "Dark Knight" as Satan's avatar in that universe, as some kind of inverse psychoanalyst/social critic, a person who tries to break the symbolic order and force this Real into human experience (if "normal" therapy tries to knit the subject's world back together). This kind of void through a broken reality is something I consider essential "dark" experience to my satanism.
I think we can say the wounded position I mentioned is close to the broken reality, but the difference is that to me the wounded position should be healed or the bleeding of which atleast directed properly. Not by building walls of protection between the Real (or oneness, as I like to call it) and the separated emanation that is the self, but bridges that eventually will serve the Real that is the Truth. Meaning and the symbolic plane would then serve the Truth, and not the justification of acting only according ot the pleasure principle. Serving means to actually help the transcendent and immanent and every sort of dualism to move towards union in a true way (not cutting corners). There meaning and Real have a sort of symbiotic co-existence, and within immanence that’s close to the reality of romanticism to me, where all the joys and terrors of life come together as awe towards it all.

The video had a good notion that we need those masks, but I guess each individual has certain kind of mask the transparency of which must vary to aid in the helping work a particular individuals structure is set to work through. Similarly as these masks and our whole identities are tools of the Master (who is part of the hierarchy where everyone is a servant and a tool to a greater whole) I think that semi-nihilistic view point of the Real presented in the video is a tool to interpret these things in a certain way, to help certain kind of temperaments to bring the needed ”essence of darkness” at reach. We, or atleast I am as a human, desperate for the positive but it is the negative, that is the darkness obviously, that really can bring some satisfaction to the longing. That is if we are succesful uniting it with the positive ”phallic” constancy of daily life, and not falling for overcompensation and destroying something with the great black fire the negative essence is about.

I wonder if the non-sexual experience of the ahegao-face can be complementary to the humorous (I think this is The cosmic joke) and tiresomeness of Priapus’ permanent erection.
User avatar
Insanus
Frater
Posts: 1015
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:06 am
Location: Helsinki

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Insanus »

Smaragd wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 11:53 pm
Insanus wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:02 pm
In my desperation to gain some understanding of Lacan's obscure concepts, I stumbled upon this video about his concept of the Real:

https://youtu.be/1UPhrQjHi_s

The Real means something like reality unmediated by language and imagination, something like a world stripped of all meaning. It's beyond all signification and comes to our experience only through traumatic experience.
I've thought of the Joker in the 2008 batman movie "Dark Knight" as Satan's avatar in that universe, as some kind of inverse psychoanalyst/social critic, a person who tries to break the symbolic order and force this Real into human experience (if "normal" therapy tries to knit the subject's world back together). This kind of void through a broken reality is something I consider essential "dark" experience to my satanism.
I think we can say the wounded position I mentioned is close to the broken reality, but the difference is that to me the wounded position should be healed or the bleeding of which atleast directed properly. Not by building walls of protection between the Real (or oneness, as I like to call it) and the separated emanation that is the self, but bridges that eventually will serve the Real that is the Truth. Meaning and the symbolic plane would then serve the Truth, and not the justification of acting only according ot the pleasure principle. Serving means to actually help the transcendent and immanent and every sort of dualism to move towards union in a true way (not cutting corners). There meaning and Real have a sort of symbiotic co-existence, and within immanence that’s close to the reality of romanticism to me, where all the joys and terrors of life come together as awe towards it all.

The video had a good notion that we need those masks, but I guess each individual has certain kind of mask the transparency of which must vary to aid in the helping work a particular individuals structure is set to work through. Similarly as these masks and our whole identities are tools of the Master (who is part of the hierarchy where everyone is a servant and a tool to a greater whole) I think that semi-nihilistic view point of the Real presented in the video is a tool to interpret these things in a certain way, to help certain kind of temperaments to bring the needed ”essence of darkness” at reach. We, or atleast I am as a human, desperate for the positive but it is the negative, that is the darkness obviously, that really can bring some satisfaction to the longing. That is if we are succesful uniting it with the positive ”phallic” constancy of daily life, and not falling for overcompensation and destroying something with the great black fire the negative essence is about.

I wonder if the non-sexual experience of the ahegao-face can be complementary to the humorous (I think this is The cosmic joke) and tiresomeness of Priapus’ permanent erection.
I hope I'm following you.
It is a serious question of ethics whether a harmful truth should be conscious at all, especially concerning the Real which seems to be in a sense the wound of being a subject in the first place. To me it seems that the wounded position is the only human position and you have to become posthuman, "dead tool of the master" so to speak, if you want to go forward beyond a certain point, meaning that if you want to "keep the real" , the self has got to go. It is not in any way obvious whether this is the right thing to do or a horrendous mistake from the viewpoint of occult growth. Of course equating the real with mystical oneness also has it's problems, but I guess we are on the same page here.

I think if you'd think that Priapus' erection could be seen as the blazing Sun and ahegao as the inhuman ecstacy of over-the-limit, there is a sort of hellfire-union resembling Blake :)
With a taste of a poison paradigm
Kavi
Frater
Posts: 412
Joined: Mon May 09, 2016 4:52 pm

Re: "Dark" in Satanism

Post by Kavi »

As I mentioned before "colorful" I think I also get angry from it. ( Also Nefastos brought good idea about "White" and unicorns)

But at the same time I remember how around 5 years ago I used to be really the "underground man" who hated that after summer the autumn begins and leaves drop from trees and then winter begins. Each year trees die and world looks grey just because for "the pure mockery" was my interpretation.
I hated the natural cycle of year as much as Dostoevsky's underground man hated 2+2=4. Why it has to be 4 why not 5 or 3 or...?
Although finite and infinite might be quite close to each other in some aspects. Maybe after all my rage was about my own mechanical understanding of life and nature.

All colors somehow symbolize the multitude of possibilities and how life and freedom realized in the infinity and space which never stops extending and you never find it's edge or wall - archons will silently give up space and you never know too much but the journey goes on and on. It's like the fruit of knowledge is hooked to a fishing rod and you swim far-far away from shore. It's terrifying.

I found old sketch I wrote in 2015 and it read:

"The world is crying in pain but He silences their mouths
The girders of firmament* are rotten from our tears
Four angels of cardinal directions, malnourished
We all are going to die soon."

(I don't know if translation makes any sense but taivaankannen palkit* was the word I tried to look for.
Although now I think it would be more terrifying if angels get nourished from these tears and from rot and this kind of life will go on and on...)

It's at the same time some kind of useless and impotent rebellion projected into every direction in the pitch black darkness where the only chains are bind by myself but probably with self-reflection the outcome might be fruitful.
7&8
Post Reply