Polyhymnia wrote: ↑
Wed May 08, 2019 10:54 pm
Indeed warning of death sounds pretty grim. Do they make it clear if they mean physical or spiritual death? Because not all death is bad, and I mean that as in the death of things that no longer serve us on a mental and spiritual plane, but physical death due to a chant gone wrong seems a little intense. I think Cerastes is on the right trail with how that death may come to fruition.
I think they mean something like a self-inflicted accident that can lead to own physical death or lover's death due to wrong circulation of acausal energy. They themselves do not say that death is a bad thing. They explicitly say, "Love nothing so much that you can not see it die because death is a natural change of energies."
Heith wrote: ↑
Fri May 10, 2019 3:45 pm
I think that with occult work it is not very wise to go about without at least some kind of a plan. I also think that our contemporary time, which is very surface-focused, puts too much value on the visible or outer layers. This is true in the occult world also. Too much value is put on rituals and how things look like, and too little on person's inner growth which in my opinion is largely a journey of ethical and philosophical pondering. But I get why it doesn't interest most people, it can be very unexciting work. I do think that some things we are able to make our mind on without having to try it. For example I certainly can understand that I don't have to kill someone in order to understand that it would be wrong to kill someone.
The reader will bear in mind as they read my text that I detest ONA and other groups of similar nature that idolize violence, torture and/or criminal acts. To me this is nothing but a continuation of the blackmetal & motorcycle mindset; absurdly childish, weak and contrary to what they are quick to say, extremely herd mentality. I've rarely encountered as frail egos as in that kind of circles. There is a lot of unnecessary mystifying in groups like that. It bores me. I do think that there is a level of this deliberate mystifying in these rituals you mentioned, the purpose is to attract people with it because it sounds "cool".
My motivation for my path may sound childish, but it's because it's very hard to describe. Of course my motive is not based on primitive aesthetics. And I clearly deny the Nazi and violence-glorifying aspects, because they lead to the ultimate self-destruction, without being progressive in any way.
The members say that all of the "satanism stuff" is just a gate, just a first step to higher levels. And Anton Long clearly states that Nazism was only a means to an end (not for me, as stated above) and that they now plan to work on a different level. The main focus is clearly on the star game (for me a prototype of mathematical and multi-dimensional magick) and on the chants calling the acausal to bring back the "dark gods". Satan was just one of the gods who was here and revealed himself in many faces (as demons and rebellious mythological figures like Loki). They call themselves Satanists because he was the most famous "dark god" who stayed here. In the o9a, I see a search for the new, for the possibility of calling all the dark gods to transcend the body, psyche, and the spirit, the quest to understand the incomprehensible, and the courage to give everything up for evolution.
The order is (of course mostly rightly) criticized. But it is not bad to learn about the philosophy and to pick out and develop positive aspects. "Every blind chicken also finds a grain", as we say in Germany. Every philosophy has something true and one should then respect that truth and respect its origin.
Cerastes wrote: ↑
Fri May 10, 2019 4:53 pm
This is very accurate. Especially this Hitler-worshipping or worship of evil in general while claiming to be an individualist and hating on religions is such a hyprocrisy. Whoever automatically worships what society fears most is driven by society. They would worship a pink teddybear if society was frightned about pink teddybears. At least this would look much more fluffy than the swastika.
Yes you are right. But also not. Nazism was only a means to an end and a test of whether you are ready to give up the primitive conception of good and evil. I think they chose Nazism because their actions are hard to forgive, and most "moral" people hesitate, or even go away, when they are unwilling to accept evil and are unwilling to abandon primitive concepts.
And it also has something to do with challenge. Most people stop at this point because they despise appropriate ideologies, but as they take further steps, they free themselves from their sophisticated moral notions. And for those who are right-wing extremists, the surprise of the inside roles awaits them. You may then have to be active in a leftist party or even propagate communist thoughts.
Again, I'm against violent inside roles and against Nazism, but that's not the point. I just want to make it clear that you just do not have to stay on the surface and also have to look for truths in unpleasant worldviews. To describe something as "Hittler-worship" without informing yourself is (I am sorry to say so) just narrow-minded. At least that's something I've learned through my satanic path.
Cerastes wrote: ↑
Fri May 10, 2019 4:53 pm
I usually start an occut practice when I’m certain about the purpose. That’s important because a chaotic mind like mine would easily go the wrong direction. Of course at the beginning, I tried different things too but at some point one should think about the purpose of the work and the inner process as Sor Heith mentioned. Most people get there when the work becomes more serious, I guess.
That's it. I have not found the true path yet. That's why I ask, in how far experimenting is wise, without taking drastic consequences into account.