Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
- Seeker666
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- Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 12:24 am
Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
hello, I wanted to ask in regards to Anti-cosmic Philosophies in Satanism and how they relate to the brotherhood...
how exactly does one hate life?
is it more hating the materialism that makes up life? and realizing it is all ash and bones anyway?
can one find beauty in Nature? even though it is Fallen?
is there a balance between life and Death?
light and darkness?
Love and Hate?
i've been confused on the necessity to hate life, and hate the universe, and hate humanity.
Frater Nefastos especially, if you describe Satanism as both Misanthropic and Philanthropic what is the real purpose of hating all mankind? is it literally the Destruction of mankind we are after? or is it the destruction of ignorance? Is the Destruction that the gods of Death, Destruction, Chaos, Darkness, etc bring literal? or is it symbolic? as some translations of Abel being the ignorant clay-born ego of Cain?
Do we seek for the dissolution and annihilation of all things? returning to the point in Chaos from whence we were ripped? or is it symbolic as well?
is creation an opposite and adverse concept to Destruction? is the purpose of Destruction to yield creation?
many questions i've been pondering.... looking forward to your replies my friends.
how exactly does one hate life?
is it more hating the materialism that makes up life? and realizing it is all ash and bones anyway?
can one find beauty in Nature? even though it is Fallen?
is there a balance between life and Death?
light and darkness?
Love and Hate?
i've been confused on the necessity to hate life, and hate the universe, and hate humanity.
Frater Nefastos especially, if you describe Satanism as both Misanthropic and Philanthropic what is the real purpose of hating all mankind? is it literally the Destruction of mankind we are after? or is it the destruction of ignorance? Is the Destruction that the gods of Death, Destruction, Chaos, Darkness, etc bring literal? or is it symbolic? as some translations of Abel being the ignorant clay-born ego of Cain?
Do we seek for the dissolution and annihilation of all things? returning to the point in Chaos from whence we were ripped? or is it symbolic as well?
is creation an opposite and adverse concept to Destruction? is the purpose of Destruction to yield creation?
many questions i've been pondering.... looking forward to your replies my friends.
"Eritis sicut Deus, Scientes Bonum et Malum"- Mephistopheles
- Nefastos
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- Location: Helsinki
Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
Seeker666 wrote:Frater Nefastos especially, if you describe Satanism as both Misanthropic and Philanthropic what is the real purpose of hating all mankind? is it literally the Destruction of mankind we are after?
If one believes in karma, i.e. energetical bonds created by mind, there is no point trying to destroy mankind by force. Even if we destroyed the whole planet, the real psychic bonds would be there, even more than ever. The true "heaviest matter" keeping the soul imprisoned is emotional and intellectual, not physical. (This will be explained in the book Argarizim, now available only in Finnish.)
Because of this, that "literal destruction of mankind" we are after is the one that can only be accomplished by ascension, that is, by finding release from earthly existence by understanding it totally, not by ripping oneself or others out of it by force.
This is why Gnosticism has that particular name: Gnostics believed in the dualistic strife (spirit rising against matter) in the cosmos that is fundamentally monistic - a paradox, there. But even Gnostics believed the way to do is by gnosis: the spiritual knowledge. The use of violence - spiritual, astral or physical - to create perfect anticosmic night is doomed to fail, because the occult bondage ("karma") will be left even if the whole planet is destroyed. If there would be no such karma, there would be no reincarnation, and without reincarnation, anti-cosmicist's job would be easy as pie: just to kill oneself & to find annihilation that easily. Sadly that's not how it works.
So, if I am an anticosmic Satanist, I am it in a Gnostic way rather than by the way of violence.
Faust: "Lo contempla. / Ei muove in tortuosa spire / e s'avvicina lento alla nostra volta. / Oh! se non erro, / orme di foco imprime al suol!"
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Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
I answered "no", although I have certain sympathy towards anti-cosmicism on emotional level.
One does not need to believe in karma to refute anti-cosmicism. A will to perish is still a will (and actually a quite intensive will), and therefore willing there to be no will is psychologically impossible.
On the level of metaphysical speculation this could be expressed in the following way: if creation is timeless, every will is in a sense creating the cosmic order all the time. It is impossible to make the creation non-existent, not that much because of empirical limitations but because on a deeper level, it is not anyone´s will.
One does not need to believe in karma to refute anti-cosmicism. A will to perish is still a will (and actually a quite intensive will), and therefore willing there to be no will is psychologically impossible.
On the level of metaphysical speculation this could be expressed in the following way: if creation is timeless, every will is in a sense creating the cosmic order all the time. It is impossible to make the creation non-existent, not that much because of empirical limitations but because on a deeper level, it is not anyone´s will.
- Insanus
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Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
I'll also give some personal opinions.
Hating humanity is paradoxically hating the lack of human qualities.
To me it's more like hating the chains that bind conciousness to matter. It can be balanced with healthy appreciation of death, by "realizing it is all ash and bones anyway" as you well put it.Seeker666 wrote: is it more hating the materialism that makes up life? and realizing it is all ash and bones anyway?
If they are opposites, their balance would also be their annihilation & therefore...Seeker666 wrote: is there a balance between life and Death?
light and darkness?
Love and Hate?
...yes. Which ultimately means recognizing Unity.Seeker666 wrote: Do we seek for the dissolution and annihilation of all things?
I think that to hate humanity is to have high ideals concerning what humanity should be like. It's not the same as hating human beings as such, but more like hating their psychological & moral conditions which waste a lot of human potential.Seeker666 wrote: i've been confused on the necessity to hate life, and hate the universe, and hate humanity.
Hating humanity is paradoxically hating the lack of human qualities.
Jumalan synnit ovat kourallinen hiekkaa ihmisen valtameressä
- Seeker666
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- Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 12:24 am
Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
Very interesting and thought provoking replies! Thank you my brothers!
And yes, Insanus, I do agree that balance will lead to their dissolution. As even opposites have form, and when that form is dissolved, light and darkness will be as one. What do you think?
And yes, Insanus, I do agree that balance will lead to their dissolution. As even opposites have form, and when that form is dissolved, light and darkness will be as one. What do you think?
"Eritis sicut Deus, Scientes Bonum et Malum"- Mephistopheles
- Insanus
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Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
Exactly. That's what we are trying to do the best we canSeeker666 wrote:Very interesting and thought provoking replies! Thank you my brothers!
And yes, Insanus, I do agree that balance will lead to their dissolution. As even opposites have form, and when that form is dissolved, light and darkness will be as one. What do you think?
Jumalan synnit ovat kourallinen hiekkaa ihmisen valtameressä
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Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
Nefastos wrote:Seeker666 wrote:Frater Nefastos especially, if you describe Satanism as both Misanthropic and Philanthropic what is the real purpose of hating all mankind? is it literally the Destruction of mankind we are after?
If one believes in karma, i.e. energetical bonds created by mind, there is no point trying to destroy mankind by force. Even if we destroyed the whole planet, the real psychic bonds would be there, even more than ever. The true "heaviest matter" keeping the soul imprisoned is emotional and intellectual, not physical. (This will be explained in the book Argarizim, now available only in Finnish.)
Because of this, that "literal destruction of mankind" we are after is the one that can only be accomplished by ascension, that is, by finding release from earthly existence by understanding it totally, not by ripping oneself or others out of it by force.
This is why Gnosticism has that particular name: Gnostics believed in the dualistic strife (spirit rising against matter) in the cosmos that is fundamentally monistic - a paradox, there. But even Gnostics believed the way to do is by gnosis: the spiritual knowledge. The use of violence - spiritual, astral or physical - to create perfect anticosmic night is doomed to fail, because the occult bondage ("karma") will be left even if the whole planet is destroyed. If there would be no such karma, there would be no reincarnation, and without reincarnation, anti-cosmicist's job would be easy as pie: just to kill oneself & to find annihilation that easily. Sadly that's not how it works.
So, if I am an anticosmic Satanist, I am it in a Gnostic way rather than by the way of violence.
I am sorry for joining this discussion a bit late. Honestly, I put my signature under every word that fra Nefastos has written.
"I am not what happened to me, I am what I choose to become."
— C.G. Jung
— C.G. Jung
- Seeker666
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 12:24 am
Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
so it's like hating humanity for lack of what is known as "humane behavior"?Insanus wrote:I'll also give some personal opinions.
To me it's more like hating the chains that bind conciousness to matter. It can be balanced with healthy appreciation of death, by "realizing it is all ash and bones anyway" as you well put it.Seeker666 wrote: is it more hating the materialism that makes up life? and realizing it is all ash and bones anyway?
Seeker666 wrote: is there a balance between life and Death?
light and darkness?
Love and Hate?
If they are opposites, their balance would also be their annihilation & therefore...
...yes. Which ultimately means recognizing Unity.Seeker666 wrote: Do we seek for the dissolution and annihilation of all things?
I think that to hate humanity is to have high ideals concerning what humanity should be like. It's not the same as hating human beings as such, but more like hating their psychological & moral conditions which waste a lot of human potential.Seeker666 wrote: i've been confused on the necessity to hate life, and hate the universe, and hate humanity.
Hating humanity is paradoxically hating the lack of human qualities.
"Eritis sicut Deus, Scientes Bonum et Malum"- Mephistopheles
- Insanus
- Posts: 835
- Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:06 am
- Location: Helsinki
Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
Behavior in itself doesn't have too much to do with it in my opinion. It seems that often times a very misantrophic person can still see beauty in nature & in animals. So maybe one hates humanity rather for the lack of soul or the lack of true values. I believe so.Seeker666 wrote:so it's like hating humanity for lack of what is known as "humane behavior"?Insanus wrote:I'll also give some personal opinions.
To me it's more like hating the chains that bind conciousness to matter. It can be balanced with healthy appreciation of death, by "realizing it is all ash and bones anyway" as you well put it.Seeker666 wrote: is it more hating the materialism that makes up life? and realizing it is all ash and bones anyway?
Seeker666 wrote: is there a balance between life and Death?
light and darkness?
Love and Hate?
If they are opposites, their balance would also be their annihilation & therefore...
...yes. Which ultimately means recognizing Unity.Seeker666 wrote: Do we seek for the dissolution and annihilation of all things?
I think that to hate humanity is to have high ideals concerning what humanity should be like. It's not the same as hating human beings as such, but more like hating their psychological & moral conditions which waste a lot of human potential.Seeker666 wrote: i've been confused on the necessity to hate life, and hate the universe, and hate humanity.
Hating humanity is paradoxically hating the lack of human qualities.
I think that the true (even if unconscious) driving force & motivation in even the most "evil" anti-life ideologies, is the willingness to destroy the obstacles from the way of truth. Even the word "apocalypse" means "un-covering" which tells something in my opinion.
Jumalan synnit ovat kourallinen hiekkaa ihmisen valtameressä
- Nefastos
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Re: Anti-Cosmic philosophy in Satanism
The last few months have been for me more infused with feelings of both anti-cosmic & anti-Christian angst than for some time before. There are several reasons, so this is not mysterious. Yet, it's interesting to note.
Recently we discussed about Despair, & I strongly feel that it is that "highest sin" precisely that has the most to do with the anti-cosmic philosophy. One feels that nothing is enough; whatever one will do, it is never enough to bring forth even subjective perfection, let alone macrocosmic. World at large seems to have something against against true attainment; the collective resistance is just too strong for an individual to cast one's world anew & make the difference.
But those are not philosophical arguments, they are just - emotions. Very understandable emotions, but still emotions that ultimately lead to uphold and not change the present state of being. It's like Vishnu (god of stability & upholding life) disguising himself as Shiva (god of destruction & spiritual transmutation). When we start to feel despair, it leads to short term solutions, instead of making slow progressive steps in true occult development. For example, suicide as ultimately anti-cosmic decision (of giving a finger to God, if not anything else) also ultimately slows down rather than quickens the process of Uncreation.
It's one fucked-up world, always able to turn even our own smallest mistakes against us.
Recently we discussed about Despair, & I strongly feel that it is that "highest sin" precisely that has the most to do with the anti-cosmic philosophy. One feels that nothing is enough; whatever one will do, it is never enough to bring forth even subjective perfection, let alone macrocosmic. World at large seems to have something against against true attainment; the collective resistance is just too strong for an individual to cast one's world anew & make the difference.
But those are not philosophical arguments, they are just - emotions. Very understandable emotions, but still emotions that ultimately lead to uphold and not change the present state of being. It's like Vishnu (god of stability & upholding life) disguising himself as Shiva (god of destruction & spiritual transmutation). When we start to feel despair, it leads to short term solutions, instead of making slow progressive steps in true occult development. For example, suicide as ultimately anti-cosmic decision (of giving a finger to God, if not anything else) also ultimately slows down rather than quickens the process of Uncreation.
It's one fucked-up world, always able to turn even our own smallest mistakes against us.
Faust: "Lo contempla. / Ei muove in tortuosa spire / e s'avvicina lento alla nostra volta. / Oh! se non erro, / orme di foco imprime al suol!"