What is occultism?

Rational discussions on metaphysical and abstract topics.
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Insanus
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Re: What is occultism?

Post by Insanus »

Conscious effort to live as the Universe.
Jumalan synnit ovat kourallinen hiekkaa ihmisen valtameressä
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Nefastos
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Re: What is occultism?

Post by Nefastos »

Insanus wrote:Conscious effort to live as the Universe.


That works. Uniting Microcosm ("that which is below") to the Macrocosm ("that which is above") in a necessarily harmonious way will bring forth both wisdom & power discussed above. Besides, in Insanus' description one can - I think - already find all the four Faivrean points hidden.

Jiva wrote:Actually, Faivre had six points, the four already mentioned being necessary with the final two of concordance (essentially, comparative mythology) and transmission (the master disciple relationship) being optional. In my opinion I think concordance may as well be a fifth necessity.


At least it's a necessity that one should be able & willing to seek concordance if there is enough material to study & compare several traditions. But surely it's possible (or have been possible) to be an occultist even if one doesn't know enough of the different mythologies to be able to compare them. For example, one could be an orthodox kabbalist & learn everything from that one specific tradition alone.

But too much orthodoxy certainly starts to gnaw the roots of occultism at some point, because it strikes to that which I see as the one basic point of occultism: doctrine of Unity. For if one would have possibility to embrace different kinds of ideas & esoteric philosophies but would be unwilling to do that because of the thought that one's own tradition is most pure... in that case, occultism has changed to theological fundamentalism, and is more emotional than holistic, as occult philosophy always should be. But perhaps "occult ethics" is little different subject than what Faivre had in mind. Still, one can't leave that question (problem of ethics) out of any philosophical structure.
Faust: "Lo contempla. / Ei muove in tortuosa spire / e s'avvicina lento alla nostra volta. / Oh! se non erro, / orme di foco imprime al suol!"
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Jiva
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Re: What is occultism?

Post by Jiva »

Well, if one accepts Faivre's definitions, I think the first two criteria (correspondence and living nature) suggest at least some recognition of different cultural traditions which may appear different, but with which there is some concordance. There seems to me to be a degree of subjectivism within occultist belief, whereas perhaps those of a more orthodox persuasion could perhaps be described as following tenets of mysticism. This might seem unnecessarily pedantic, but I do think there are key differences between the two definitions, although obviously a huge amount in common.
'Oh Krishna, restless and overpowering, this mind is overwhelmingly strong; I think we might as easily gain control over the wind as over this.'
Fomalhaut
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Re: What is occultism?

Post by Fomalhaut »

The knowledge and execution of the knowledge to be able to return to zero point in where there is absolute unity.
"I am not what happened to me, I am what I choose to become."
— C.G. Jung
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Jiva
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Re: What is occultism?

Post by Jiva »

I was recently thinking about this question again.

Faivre’s classification of occultism is kind of omnipresent academically, but I’ve noticed that many criticisms simply describe it as similar to Plotinism, particularly his use of the term “correspondences” (i.e. sympathies) which is ultimately the first of his defined characteristics of western esotericism. Basically, I suppose the impression that some get is an intention to order things in relation to one another around an unchanging and inactive One, from which everything descends (or perhaps emanates) but which never changes or even interacts.

Kind of similar to Faivre’s definition of western esotericism is Christoph Markshies’ definition of Gnosticism which is definitely relevant to any definition of occultism:
  1. The idea of a completely transcendent, remote, and supreme God.
  2. The introduction of further divine figures or the splitting of existing figures into those that are nearer to man than the distant supreme God.
  3. The evaluation of the world and matter as an evil creation and the consequent Gnostic experience of being in an alien world.
  4. The introduction of a creative deity or assistant, usually called the demiurge according to Platonic tradition, seen as both ignorant and as a counterfoil to the Deity.
  5. The explanation of this state through a mythological drama, in which the divine element falls from his own sphere into the evil world, slumbers as a divine spark in a certain class of men, and can then be liberated.
  6. Knowledge (“Gnosis”) about this situation, which is often achieved through a transcendent redeemer figure descending from a higher sphere and then returning.
  7. Redemption through and understanding that God is living as a spark in man.
  8. A variable tendency towards dualism, which can be expressed in the concept of deity, in the juxtaposition of spirit and matter, and in anthropology.
'Oh Krishna, restless and overpowering, this mind is overwhelmingly strong; I think we might as easily gain control over the wind as over this.'
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